I've finally emerged from my world of darkness. Or rather, my world of endless, forever present-preparation. I was kinda wrapped up in presents. But they are finally off to the States! (Post Office vultures...)
So to get in the Christmas Eve spirit last night, I watched "The Santa Clause" for the first time in years.
Mostly for Bernard. (
onlymesmerized this is all your fault.)

I love his jewelry.




Buttons!


I was intrigued by the elves a number of times in this movie because there was so much left a mystery about them.
A. THE CONVERSATION BETWEEN THE NEW SANTA AND JUDY, A FEMALE ELF
From this conversation, we can posit several things:
1. Elves can have sex with Santa (ow my brain).
-Santa is obviously trying to use humor to combat his disbelief and insecurity about being landed in this crazy new place with all these strange little people. But Judy takes him seriously and thinks that he's actually coming on to her.
-Yet she doesn't say "Ewww, you're a human!" She doesn't make a face or shift away or do any of the things people do when taboos are broken.
-The reason she gives for her polite refusal of his apparent interest is that she's already in a relationship, not that it would be impossible for her and Santa to ever have a relationship.
This could mean that, culturally speaking:
a. Elves can have sex with humans.
b. Elves can have sex with Santa only among all humans.
c. Elves can have sex only with other elves.
The question needing to be answered here is: Is Santa an elf?
-When he asks who is the head elf, the elves say, "You are."
-He has magic now, changing his physical appearance. He uses elf magic later to drive the sleigh, come to Charlie, etc. But Charlie also uses the elf magic to call his dad with the snow globe and use the sleigh.
So is Santa simply possessed/affected by elf magic, or does he control it like an elf?
2. Elves live for a freaking long time.
Elves do not age, seem not to die of natural causes, and I wonder if you could kill them by means of physical harm. Are they invulnerable? Does their magic protect them from that as well?
If Santa is an elf now, it would follow that he could also live forever, and perhaps the old Santa's fall from the roof proves that elves can be killed by external trauma. This is only true, however, if one accepts that Santa is an elf, which I think the evidence casts into doubt. (Do we ever really see him in control of the magic? No, he is always tossed around and bullied by it. This might be because he is new and hasn't learned yet, true, but he still seems more human than elf.)
Judy has been around for at least 1200 years.
Where did the elves come from and why did they leave? Were they persecuted? Is the North Pole their Zion?
What came first, Christmas at the North Pole or elves at the North Pole? Did the elves invent Christmas?
For Judy, in the more-than-1200 years she's been alive, one of her most important accomplishments is to have perfected a good hot cocoa recipe. I mean really.
That just goes to show how different the elves' priorities are from our own. Christmas is paramount. Did they just stop caring about everything else out of self-protection, like an old retired general devoted to his gardening?
Have they lived all of those years in this insular community at the North Pole? God but I would be sick of those people after the first 200 years. And yet, Judy is still forming new relationships. She's "seeing someone in Wrapping," not married.
New relationships beg the question: Can the elves reproduce? If so, wouldn't the North Pole get a little crowded (not to mention highly incestuous) after a while?
B. ELF MAGIC AND TECHNOLOGY
1. Elves have innate magic.
-Bernard can appear and disappear at will. We see much evidence of their magic in the operation of the North Pole facility, the workings of the sleigh, and perhaps the reindeer's flight powers as well.
-Are elves really corporeal as we think of it? Maybe they're made entirely of magic, and that's why they don't age or die.
2. Elves use technology.
-The audience's first introduction to elves is when an elf punches in a code on the North Pole, opening the door to the facility.
-The jetpacks also seem technological.
-The toys they make, like the propeller planes and train set, work with children who don't use magic.
-One of the transportation options within the North Pole facility is a train that seems to operate like a regular train.
-Some of the sleigh accoutrements, like the anti-radar etc. seem technological.
Does their technology run on magic?
-The jetpacks and other technological things could be perfectly functional but have no fuel or power source - they could be running off magic as a power source.
Or are the elves in fact technomages?
-This would put a whole new spin on their magic usage. Bernard, instead of disappearing, would simply have mastered the elusive teleportation technology. Genetic engineering and nanoviruses could account for their eternal life and youth. Technology sufficiently complicated, after all, seems like magic.
Does elf technology come from human technology, adapted to work with their magic?
Or, more interestingly, does human technology come from the technomage elves? A physics book to a bright child here, a complicated mechanical toy to a future inventor there....
Alternatively, it could be argued that elves are a victim of their magic. Santa at the beginning doesn't want to be Santa. He doesn't want to have white hair or be fat or deliver presents. Yet he learns that he can't resist the magic that changes his appearance. And gradually he accepts his present-delivering role (because he is brainwashed by the magic?).
Maybe the elves started out similarly. Maybe they had their own culture and own individual desires, but they stumbled across the North Pole in their tribal wanderings of long ago, and were caught by the magic - this "Spirit of Christmas" - and could never leave. They were frozen in time, unable to age, unable to have children, unable to do anything but become the perfect servants to the "Spirit of Christmas."
Is this "Spirit of Christmas" in fact an insidious force that mindrapes Santa and the elves into serving IT above all things?
When Santa tries to rebel, to break free of his role, Bernard warns him in a room full of silently judgemental elves, "You wouldn't want to be responsible for killing the Spirit of Christmas, now would you?"
Is this "Christmas Spirit" actually a spirit, a demon (Buffyverse style), holding everyone in its thrall? Does it feed off our belief and adulation? Maybe its powers are blunted by the sheer number of people in the world, and it only can really capture those young, malleable minds for a time, but that's enough to keep it going.
In this view, "Christmas" amounts to nothing but a psychic parasite.
So, um... Merry Christmas everyone!
These are the things I think about when watching children's movies apparently. LOL.
Wow, how much do I love over-analyzing silly stuff? THIS MUCH. Ah, those bygone college days...
So to get in the Christmas Eve spirit last night, I watched "The Santa Clause" for the first time in years.
Mostly for Bernard. (

I love his jewelry.




Buttons!


I was intrigued by the elves a number of times in this movie because there was so much left a mystery about them.
A. THE CONVERSATION BETWEEN THE NEW SANTA AND JUDY, A FEMALE ELF
From this conversation, we can posit several things:
1. Elves can have sex with Santa (ow my brain).
-Santa is obviously trying to use humor to combat his disbelief and insecurity about being landed in this crazy new place with all these strange little people. But Judy takes him seriously and thinks that he's actually coming on to her.
-Yet she doesn't say "Ewww, you're a human!" She doesn't make a face or shift away or do any of the things people do when taboos are broken.
-The reason she gives for her polite refusal of his apparent interest is that she's already in a relationship, not that it would be impossible for her and Santa to ever have a relationship.
This could mean that, culturally speaking:
a. Elves can have sex with humans.
b. Elves can have sex with Santa only among all humans.
c. Elves can have sex only with other elves.
The question needing to be answered here is: Is Santa an elf?
-When he asks who is the head elf, the elves say, "You are."
-He has magic now, changing his physical appearance. He uses elf magic later to drive the sleigh, come to Charlie, etc. But Charlie also uses the elf magic to call his dad with the snow globe and use the sleigh.
So is Santa simply possessed/affected by elf magic, or does he control it like an elf?
2. Elves live for a freaking long time.
Elves do not age, seem not to die of natural causes, and I wonder if you could kill them by means of physical harm. Are they invulnerable? Does their magic protect them from that as well?
If Santa is an elf now, it would follow that he could also live forever, and perhaps the old Santa's fall from the roof proves that elves can be killed by external trauma. This is only true, however, if one accepts that Santa is an elf, which I think the evidence casts into doubt. (Do we ever really see him in control of the magic? No, he is always tossed around and bullied by it. This might be because he is new and hasn't learned yet, true, but he still seems more human than elf.)
Judy has been around for at least 1200 years.
Where did the elves come from and why did they leave? Were they persecuted? Is the North Pole their Zion?
What came first, Christmas at the North Pole or elves at the North Pole? Did the elves invent Christmas?
For Judy, in the more-than-1200 years she's been alive, one of her most important accomplishments is to have perfected a good hot cocoa recipe. I mean really.
That just goes to show how different the elves' priorities are from our own. Christmas is paramount. Did they just stop caring about everything else out of self-protection, like an old retired general devoted to his gardening?
Have they lived all of those years in this insular community at the North Pole? God but I would be sick of those people after the first 200 years. And yet, Judy is still forming new relationships. She's "seeing someone in Wrapping," not married.
New relationships beg the question: Can the elves reproduce? If so, wouldn't the North Pole get a little crowded (not to mention highly incestuous) after a while?
B. ELF MAGIC AND TECHNOLOGY
1. Elves have innate magic.
-Bernard can appear and disappear at will. We see much evidence of their magic in the operation of the North Pole facility, the workings of the sleigh, and perhaps the reindeer's flight powers as well.
-Are elves really corporeal as we think of it? Maybe they're made entirely of magic, and that's why they don't age or die.
2. Elves use technology.
-The audience's first introduction to elves is when an elf punches in a code on the North Pole, opening the door to the facility.
-The jetpacks also seem technological.
-The toys they make, like the propeller planes and train set, work with children who don't use magic.
-One of the transportation options within the North Pole facility is a train that seems to operate like a regular train.
-Some of the sleigh accoutrements, like the anti-radar etc. seem technological.
Does their technology run on magic?
-The jetpacks and other technological things could be perfectly functional but have no fuel or power source - they could be running off magic as a power source.
Or are the elves in fact technomages?
-This would put a whole new spin on their magic usage. Bernard, instead of disappearing, would simply have mastered the elusive teleportation technology. Genetic engineering and nanoviruses could account for their eternal life and youth. Technology sufficiently complicated, after all, seems like magic.
Does elf technology come from human technology, adapted to work with their magic?
Or, more interestingly, does human technology come from the technomage elves? A physics book to a bright child here, a complicated mechanical toy to a future inventor there....
Alternatively, it could be argued that elves are a victim of their magic. Santa at the beginning doesn't want to be Santa. He doesn't want to have white hair or be fat or deliver presents. Yet he learns that he can't resist the magic that changes his appearance. And gradually he accepts his present-delivering role (because he is brainwashed by the magic?).
Maybe the elves started out similarly. Maybe they had their own culture and own individual desires, but they stumbled across the North Pole in their tribal wanderings of long ago, and were caught by the magic - this "Spirit of Christmas" - and could never leave. They were frozen in time, unable to age, unable to have children, unable to do anything but become the perfect servants to the "Spirit of Christmas."
Is this "Spirit of Christmas" in fact an insidious force that mindrapes Santa and the elves into serving IT above all things?
When Santa tries to rebel, to break free of his role, Bernard warns him in a room full of silently judgemental elves, "You wouldn't want to be responsible for killing the Spirit of Christmas, now would you?"
Is this "Christmas Spirit" actually a spirit, a demon (Buffyverse style), holding everyone in its thrall? Does it feed off our belief and adulation? Maybe its powers are blunted by the sheer number of people in the world, and it only can really capture those young, malleable minds for a time, but that's enough to keep it going.
In this view, "Christmas" amounts to nothing but a psychic parasite.
So, um... Merry Christmas everyone!
These are the things I think about when watching children's movies apparently. LOL.
Wow, how much do I love over-analyzing silly stuff? THIS MUCH. Ah, those bygone college days...
(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-25 01:57 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-25 02:50 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-25 05:54 pm (UTC)Yet she doesn't say "Ewww, you're a human!" She doesn't make a face or shift away or do any of the things people do when taboos are broken.
Yes, she took the comment seriously. However, perhaps she didn't rebuke Santa for his inter-species incestuous thoughts simply because she must culturally defer to him. For example, that gaijin teacher in one of the books we read for seminar was unintentionally embarrassed simply because a Japanese subordinate could not bring herself to correct the superior sensei. Thus, the lack of an "eeeww" is not enough to infer elf-human relations.
the old Santa's fall from the roof proves that elves can be killed by external trauma
I thought that the old Santa waved or something to the camera while no one was looking. So in fact, he didn't die. He "retired". Of course, this is likely editing on the part of the Spirit of Christmas...
Is this "Spirit of Christmas" in fact an insidious force that mindrapes Santa and the elves into serving IT above all things?
What is interesting is not that the Spirit of Christmas could be forcing the elves and Santa to do its bidding. What IS interesting is that Santa/elves enjoy doing it regardless. Furthermore, they are bringing happiness to millions of people. So, the question then becomes, is what the Spirit of Christmas is doing so wrong? Is it alright to hold the elves hostage and dumb if it brings them happiness (rather like some kind of Eden)? Is the road to hell in fact paved with good intentions?
Oh, the questions raised by such a simple plot.
(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-25 06:43 pm (UTC)First of all, I wouldn't call it incestuous.
Secondly, I don't know if I agree with your cultural deference hypothesis. Look at the behavior of the other elves (admittedly male elves) to Santa. The first elf he calls "kid" returns, "Who're you callin' kid? I've made *shoes* older than you!" And Bernard is extremely bossy, of course. So while there might be a deference going on here, I think it would have to be gender-based and not species- or job-based. And there is no evidence for a gender-based divide in authority among the elves, while there is evidence for elves insulting Santa and bossing him around.
So in fact, he didn't die. He "retired".
I didn't catch this part. If it's true, that opens up a whole new can of worms. Who decides when Santas retire? How long do they live? Are they still governed by magic? Is the new Santa chosen randomly, by the elves, by the old Santa, or by magic? Do the retired Santas get to choose what to do with the rest of their life? Can they change their appearance back from the Santa template?
I also found it very disturbing how little connection or memory any of the elves seemed to have of the old Santas. No funny stories about Santa #32's first trip in the sleigh during WWI or anything. Either the elves have inured themselves to the frequent loss of Santas (whether to death or retirement) and have not allowed themselves to become attached, or they view Santa as only a tool. A tool that they created to serve their own ends (or the ends of the Spirit of Christmas). And just - how utterly *disturbing* is that? Santa like a secret agent or something, totally expendable, completely brainwashed and transformed into what they need him for until they discard him.
this is likely editing on the part of the Spirit of Christmas...
Good eye!
So, the question then becomes, is what the Spirit of Christmas is doing so wrong?
Well, the same argument used to be used for patients being lobotomized. They would lose mental abilities and decision-making capabilities, yes, but wouldn't their life be *easier* without all those tormenting choices anyway? They would be so much *happier* that way. A similar argument was used to support slavery: They're happier with no choice. We're taking care of them. We're helping them.
The fact remains that Santa did not *choose* this life. He was forced into it. No matter how happy he seems with it now (a pretty suspicious turnaround), his own body was violated against his will repeatedly and all of his dreams and hopes and plans for the future were ripped away from him. He can't even recognize himself in the mirror. He's forced to use a new name, forced to assign to himself a new identity, and forced to *like* it, to act *happy* about it, or disappoint everyone and face dire social and cultural consequences. And if that's not brainwashing, I don't know what is.
From wikipedia: "They defined coercive persuasion as a mixture of social, psychological and physical pressures applied to produce changes in an individual's beliefs, attitudes, and behaviors."
So in the end, it's a judgement call. Do you believe that someone has the right to take away another person's identity and choices against that person's will if, in the end, the person is happy?
And what about if, as you point out, the person is making many other people happier now? Does the happiness of the many outweigh the rights of the one?
(rather like some kind of Eden)
I'm not sure what you're saying here. The North Pole is Hell and...Eden? Metaphorical Eden? Are we being cast out as we grow up and stop believing? I think you're mixing your allusions.
AND OMG JOHN YAY! I'm so glad you have an eljay now! ::snugs::
(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-25 08:48 pm (UTC)Yeah, I know. I was just trying to emphasize the cultural out-of-boundness of it. You must remember that I am not an English major and hence, am not as accurate/precise with my wording.
one of her most important accomplishments is to have perfected a good hot cocoa recipe
Well, perhaps this is the result of long lifespans and mating. They are simply so many elves that they all have incredibly specialized jobs.
And there is no evidence for a gender-based divide in authority among the elves, while there is evidence for elves insulting Santa and bossing him around.
This is only because we see hardly any female elves in the movie (beyond those ones at the end that are posing as children).
The fact remains that Santa did not *choose* this life.
Technically, he did. He puts on the suit, and in so doing, put on the role of Santa. Now, the card does not really explain what happens if one puts on the suit (it is unlikely that the new Santa-to-be would inspect it with a magnifying glass). However, it is equally unlikely that a person would blindly obey a card found on a dead man (would you have put on that suit?). This would imply either that there was once a greater deal of choice in the matter that was gradually phased out (for fear of lawsuits? hence the fine print) or that there is a greater deal of selection on the part of the Spirit of Christmas than is let on (you may only retire after finding a troubled man with faithful child prone to brainwashing).
I think you're mixing your allusions.
Well, what I meant by Eden was that it, like the North Pole, is a (magical?) place where everyone gets along. Lamb and lion live together in peace, as do elf and man. However, no free choice can be involved in the matter if Eden/the North Pole are to remain preserved. Eden could not exist if Eve suddenly felt like she wanted lamb chops. Similarly, the North Pole could only exist if Santa and elf work together toward their common goal (Christmas presents).
Of course, Adam and Eve did not have to (and in fact did not) obey the rules, and ate from the forbidden tree. Similarly, Santa does not necessarily have to obey. He could conceivably strike or retire, as the original Santa may have done (if he did not, in fact, die). He could then blend back into society as a normal (if fat) man.
For the elves, however, it is a different story. They would not blend. They may look like children for a time, but I don't think they would get by forever with the pointed ears (not to mention lack of a family). Further, I do not think Social Security could handle people who live for thousands of years. In short, the elves are screwed. So, maybe it is not the Spirit of Christmas that wishes to keep the system going. Maybe it is the elves. Fearing what would happen should the system break down, fearing the rejection of society and living pointless lives, they use their magic to ensure that the current Santa obeys. They use their magic to make him fat, bearded, and rearing to go. They give him "his" powers to do what he must. Note that it is elves who make the sled, design the outerwear, and train the reindeer. Santa may not even be necessary at all, except as a figurehead to give the elves meaning in their lives. In fact, it may be that only the head elf is fully aware of this arrangement.
So, I must ask: How can you prove that it is the Spirit of Christmas and not the elves themselves that force the continuation of the existence of Santa Claus?
(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-26 08:58 am (UTC)That's an interesting point. And I know that what I consider important is not necessarily what other people and cultures consider important. But I mean. 1200 years. For cocoa? That's all she has to show for it?
This is only because we see hardly any female elves in the movie
I'd have to disagree. I think we see only maybe slightly more male elves. The speaking parts are skewed toward male elves, though, it's true.
there was once a greater deal of choice in the matter that was gradually phased out (for fear of lawsuits? hence the fine print)
I think lawsuits are too recent a threat to be an issue here.
there is a greater deal of selection on the part of the Spirit of Christmas than is let on
I think this is likely. As you say, his actions were not logical, so he may already have been befuddled by the magic of the elves or the Spirit of Christmas. In which case, he had even less choice than was previously apparent.
He puts on the suit, and in so doing, put on the role of Santa.
It's clear that he didn't realize the implications of his actions, so he is obviously being coerced when he makes an agreement without knowing that he's making an agreement. It's a trap.
However, no free choice can be involved in the matter if Eden/the North Pole are to remain preserved.
Exactly. But who decides that there is no choice? The elves are also governed by this lack of choice. They do nothing but devote themselves to Christmas - they *can* do nothing else, or the whole system breaks down. Did they choose this as their calling (devoted priests to the Spirit or devoted to the ideals of functioning elf society), or is there an authority that compels them to give up their lives to this cause? Is that authority an elf government, an elf leader? Is it the Spirit Itself?
Fearing what would happen should the system break down, fearing the rejection of society and living pointless lives, they use their magic to ensure that the current Santa obeys...Santa may not even be necessary at all, except as a figurehead to give the elves meaning in their lives.
This is very possible. I agree that it's either the magic of the elves or the mysterious Spirit of Christmas that is controlling everything behind the scenes. It's unclear which. So to answer your question, I can't prove which one is responsible. It's open to debate.
The only thing about the elf theory that gives me pause is: If the elves use their magic to create Santa, why even bother with a human at all? Why not transform one of their own into a "jolly old elf" and avoid the unpredictable behavior of a human jeopardizing their whole operation? Does elf magic not work on other elves? Is there some kind of law that necessitates them using a human? If so, why, and made by whom?
You know Mom was just talking about watching the sequel, and now I am seriously considering it to see if it sheds any light on these points.
Ah, media studies. IT'S A SICKNESS.
(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-25 11:00 pm (UTC)John, because you're not an English major does not excuse you for using imprecise language. In fact, because you're a science major, isn't it even more important for you to be accurate? I do like how you point out that the previous Santa kind of quit, faking his own accident. OMG, Noonie, you've got to stop with elf society, psychology, etc. It is too much. Please please stop.
(no subject)
Date: 2005-12-26 04:23 am (UTC)